TK Punish

[Noetic]

Sigh... Why i torture myself, i'll never know:wallbash: . I am almost certain this will be shot down, but what the hell... Here it goes.

Obviously this community , it's servers, everything you guys do to make gaming fun and fair are incredible, and i give thanks for having me here.
The only reason i have yet to donate quite honestly is because i have been so emersed in the gaming, it's truly slipped my mind until this post.

Before i move forward, let me say that... my donation is not contingent on whether my request and/or suggestions are reciprocated to my liking. I am not that arrogant and you guys are not that foolish. Moving on.

"Big Deep Breath" Punishing for accidental team kills, why do people do it?
I have seen responses to that same question in many a places.
some of the responses, "That guy had it coming, he's a noob", "he made a stupid move, so i punished him", "he's an idiot", "he should have stopped his apc when i was crossing the road(thats funny)" "Because he deserved it".
This server as i have seen stated in the forums by admin or owner is accepting of all skill levels, Big huge cheesy smile for that:D . Thats one of the things that ,makes this server so very inviting.

But the punishing not only that i have recieved but have witnesed others recieving as well seems to be escalating in regard to accidental TK's. I can tolerate with no problem being intentionally Tk'ed, i dont really get worked up at all, but something about being punished for an accident when i whole heartedly am trying to help my team(not my KDR&other stats), brings out this devil in me.. headtwist 360 degrees, green projectile vomit on my monitor, visions of ripping "Mr. Perfects'" head off.
After someone punishes you, you might say, well hey.. I just wont back that person up when they call for it, or wont heal them when they need it, unfortunantly that hurts the team as a whole also.

I'll get to the request/Suggestion.

What about a rule in place that says "No Punishing". I can almost feel the heat of the flame now, but wait. Setting a "No Punish" rule in place also weeds out the griefers. I have seen it set up where , as soon as you punish, it kicks you for whatever determined amount of time by server/more offenses=a ban. So if that griefer stands in front of your plane then punishes you for tk'n him, he gets kicked, sure you get a tk,but the offenders learn quickly to forgive. It would seem to be less overhead for admins as well, leaving only intentional TK's to deal with.

"But what if i am honestly running to the plane and he runs me over, or what if i am running to a moving 10 ton piece of armor and he hit me and tk's me, i cant punish?" I personally believe i deserve to die in that case.

Accidental TK punish IMO hurts the team as a whole. Some folks do nothing but punish when tk'ed, its rediculous. Also, a question. is the server set-up to auto kick obvious intentional tk's, for instance a team-mate blatently guns you down point blank.
I believe there are more positive sides to a no-punish rule, but have yet to explore them. Thanks for listening folks and sorry so long-winded.

What does summarize mean?

[juuh77]

that is a sticky subject. I for one am all for the punish option though. It seems to me that if you go with a no punish rule people will actually tk more since they know they can't be punished. I don't punish for much. The only thing i really punish for now is nade spam. Its one thing when i run into a nade but its another when you are goin to do something and you are already there and some jerk throws a nade anyway cuase he thinks he will get 2 or more kills. This i punish for every time. I always looking at my HUD befor i toss anything. If you change the rule to no punish then it will get out of control in a matter of days if not hours. The minus in points is what keeps people in line .

[OvrK02]

Not a bad idea. For the intentional TK one can get an admin. I've seen the following many times as I am sure the rest of you have.
PPL will be using a vehicle of some kind. When in the air bombing a contested point. With the exception of the uber pilots(Steve off the top of my head) we all lob bombs and some times they hit where we didn't want them to.
Driving to any objective, or my personal favorite, any of the vanilla second round of any map, the first spawn. Hey if you sit their for a second and watch 30 guys run for 2 vehicles that can hold 8 so they don't have to walk. Well in my humble opinion it’s damn hilarious. End result some ones character is gona get run over. Like life, shit happens. Is it fair not really. Is this a game yes, do people at times forget this, hell yes. I think that by adding in the aforementioned posts suggestion things will either go one of two ways.
1. People will take a step back and chill out and remember it’s only a game and to have fun with it.
2. People will either overstress and have an aneurism. Seriously though those people will go to the admins. Which means more work for the admins at times.

However, playing devils advocate here, this idea could go the other way. The admins could get called all the time over dumb stuff. Ultimately it’s the owners call. The admins deal with repercussions. Whom I feel for at times, the admins that is, they are giving their time to the community and can't really enjoy the game at times. So from me to the admin team a very big THANK YOU.

Love the server and the ppls here. That’s why I keep coming back.
That’s my two cents.
Laters,
PS: To avoid the vehicle madness one could go IO. You just have to deal with really long walks and nads.

[KAstickboy]

PS: To avoid the vehicle madness one could go IO. You just have to deal with really long walks and nads.

Nads?! are those like balls? :lol: :thumbsup:

KA

[kilroy0097]

I am a firm believer that the addon setting to show everyone on the server when someone Punishes or Forgives a TK is a good add on. It puts an air of publicity for those that punish. Hence if you see someone with 6 Punishes and 0 Forgives well it shows very plainly in the text that this is a person who shows very little restraint. I see this addon more and more on servers with punish turned on. I like it and I recommend it highly on the WiH servers.

[Prowler130]

but something about being punished for an accident when i whole heartedly am trying to help my team(not my KDR&other stats), brings out this devil in me..?

Doesnt a punished tk only hurt your team score? or even your global score? If you arent worried about your score and stats, I dont see why you would be worried about a tk punish.

I will admit I punish for stupid tks. I wont punish for any tk that results from my behavior, but if some guy spams nades and says "oh, i didnt see you there you homo" (btw this happened today, and i let him slide despite his outbursts) then you better believe your ass is getting a punish. If some jet whore kills me and two others to get one guy in a damaged tank, his ass is punished too.

As far as tk's are concerned, with the exception of the stupid decisions the game makes upon a vehicle collision, there is a clear victim and a clear perp. Even if it was a stupid tk that wasnt anyones fault, the victim has a right to punish. The "perp" should have been more careful and more attentive. If the "perp" decides to argue and outburst because he was punished wrongfully, then produce some screenshots my friend because the victim must be griefing.

Thats my stance, and im not ashamed to say I punish for dumbass tks. If i feel wronged, and you diminish my fun, then its a punish (keep in mind i dont care about score, and i generally do not punish unless it diminishes my fun)

[KAstickboy]

Doesnt a punished tk only hurt your team score? or even your global score? If you arent worried about your score and stats, I dont see why you would be worried about a tk punish.

Non punish TK = -4
Punish TK = -4

There is no difference, only in the fact that if you have X (X=number set by server) of punished TKs, auto kick/ban is inforced. WiH is set at 4 if im not mistaken, ive seen other servers set at 3, 6 and even 7, just in case you bomb a whole squad at a flag.... :mgboxedin:

KA

[Prowler130]

However, playing devils advocate here, this idea could go the other way. The admins could get called all the time over dumb stuff. Ultimately it’s the owners call. The admins deal with repercussions. Whom I feel for at times, the admins that is, they are giving their time to the community and can't really enjoy the game at times. So from me to the admin team a very big THANK YOU.


THANK YOU! I for one really appreciate that comment. I dont mind doing the work and watching people. Hell, every map with the us carrier an admin usually has to sit the whole first 5-10min of a round watching the jets for griefers (and those tking jet whores). But it makes it totally worth all the time I put into adminning when I see everyone having a good time and when I see people drop into the forums and make positive posts. Im sure the whole admin team feels the same way. so like I said, thank you guys.

PS. would have fit this into my last post, but didnt read the above quote till after i posted...

[wihadmin]

with all due respect, having a rule such as "No punishing" is impossible to administer. I will not ask the admins to do that. You guys thought admining against base rapers were hard, this is 100X harder to do. This isn't happening.

The problem with the announcements is that it clogs up our logs when we're watching the server messages in-game and out of game. Punishing is part of the game since day 1. You just need to step away from the computer if it frustrates you that much.

[Noetic]

Good points made, thanks for hearing me and for the feedback.

[[W33T]ralgoth]

The thing I would add is if punish is turned off (i think it can be?) it would eliminate the auto-kick of intentional tk'ers. It is very nice that if an admin is not actively watching, intentional tk'ers will quickly be weeded out because of the auto-kick. If either punish is turned off or you get kicked for punishes, this eliminates the possibility of auto-kicking tk'ers.

All of this being said, I don't see the big deal personally. As Stick mentions, it's the same hit to your score as if you're not punished. So, unless you get 4 punishes in a round, then there really is no impact to you different than if no one punished.

If you're getting 4 punishes in a round, well, to be blunt, you probably should reconsider how you're playing.

[|2ayden]

Only thing that really upsets me is when someone bails from your blackhawk and dies then you get punished because they were to stupid to wait on deploying there chute.

[Noetic]

ralgoth;149099']The thing I would add is if punish is turned off (i think it can be?) it would eliminate the auto-kick of intentional tk'ers. It is very nice that if an admin is not actively watching, intentional tk'ers will quickly be weeded out because of the auto-kick. If either punish is turned off or you get kicked for punishes, this eliminates the possibility of auto-kicking tk'ers.

All of this being said, I don't see the big deal personally. As Stick mentions, it's the same hit to your score as if you're not punished. So, unless you get 4 punishes in a round, then there really is no impact to you different than if no one punished.

If you're getting 4 punishes in a round, well, to be blunt, you probably should reconsider how you're playing.

Again i failed to research(My Bad), for some reason i've always thought it was a greater negative impact when punished and being in someomes squad reducing thier squad score can be pretty humiliating.




with all due respect, having a rule such as "No punishing" is impossible to administer. I will not ask the admins to do that. You guys thought admining against base rapers were hard, this is 100X harder to do. This isn't happening

The problem with the announcements is that it clogs up our logs when we're watching the server messages in-game and out of game. Punishing is part of the game since day 1. You just need to step away from the computer if it frustrates you that much.


Impossible? It's being administered currently on other servers. I am not being trying to be argumentative.. Maybe just misunderstanding when you say it is "Impossible" just the same I accept "this isn't happening" at WIH.

Will consider some deep meditation for the frustration:lol: .

Thanks!